| Author |
 Topic  |
|
NaturistDoc
Forum Member
|
|
|
balataf
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/12/2010 : 11:19:44 PM
|
NaturistDoc, the main problem with the methodology of Gallup on this poll, as critiqued elsewhere, is that it makes no distinction between the conservative and libertarian viewpoints, which have clashed in several primaries already. Most libertarians will label themselves as "conservative," when the only other choice is "liberal." Other strange, but legitimate, polling results happen with such Democratic varieties as Ecology-oriented, pro-Gay Marriage voters, when compared to labor-union, Black-ethnic voters on a variety of current issues. This is not a new problem, and has resulted in such epic splits as 1968 Lyndon Johnson vs Eugene McCarthy, or the 37 primary contests in which Dubya opposed the right wing (2004 Specter Vs Toomey), which meant that most hard conservatives wondered why so many clueless people thought Dubya was a conservative during that bitter "civil war." In 2004, I carried my precicnt's Republican primary for Toomey, as committeeman.
|
Edited by - balataf on 07/12/2010 11:23:40 PM |
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 661 |
 |
|
|
NaturistDoc
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/13/2010 : 12:13:51 AM
|
You're right. Americans are all to prone to fall for political dichotomies, and categorize people as "one or the other". I'm not sure that a multi-party system is necessarily any better than our current de facto two-party system. Italy, for instance, doesn't inspire much confidence. Nevertheless, the two-party system definitely takes some of the nuance out of politics, but in this era of sound bites and short attention spans, who's got time for subtlety?
|
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 1054 |
|
|
|
balataf
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/13/2010 : 01:09:09 AM
|
And to make it harder to evaluate well, the issues come in, get obsolete, and reshuffle on a regular cyclic basis. For example, the old Progressives, like 1924's LaFollette, were hot for state action against the Federal power of Coolidge, and in a decade. they were all for Federal supremacy to back New Deal Programs. In the War of 1812, the Federalist Party. (founded to strengthen the central government,) wound up with an extreme states' rights against the (originally very states' rights) Jeffersonian De3mocrats. In my Politicometrics, I detail how each 36-yeqr cycle winds up reversing this point, as the coalitions that used states to push their version of reform, capture the Federal machinery, which leaves the other people holding some states in opposition. There have been 16 reversals since the Revolutionaries used the States to oppose the Crown.
|
Edited by - balataf on 07/13/2010 01:11:22 AM |
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 661 |
|
|
|
DaffyTaffy2
Forum Member
|
 Posted - 07/13/2010 : 02:17:03 AM
|
  Been quite some time since I have been bk on this web site. I hope all of u have been enjoying a no tan line summer! 
Alot going on in the country and in my personal affairs. But I felt compelled to write about this issue facing our country.
I attended a Tea Party event in March, were they were voting that day! in Wash. DC w/a very gooffy( good friend. It was quite interesting to see the varied walks of life who were in attendance. I have pics of the event on my FB page but am not sure how to post them on this site.
Regardless of that we made our voices heard on the issue. We visited our local congressman and womens offices and had a peacefull day if not a moving day. I was especially proud to attent in favor and not against. I have never participated in such an event, but felt moved by the American spirit that was felt there. We met many folks who had traveled days by car w no were to stay or sleep except in there cars, or camp out. That in my opinion is what the USA really stands for! STAND UP 4 WHAT U BELIEVE in ur heart.
Nov. is almost just around the corner. And the American people will vote for what they believe.
Be Blessed n GOD BLESS THIS GREAT NATION n our TROOPS FIGHTING ON FORIEGN SOIL TO KEEP US ALL SAFE
Skinny Women are not Evil
|
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 205 |
|
|
|
sailawaybob
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/18/2010 : 01:05:03 AM
|
Daffy you are right november is around the corner and Americans need to get out and vote, i hope those that do will turn off the entertainment tv shows and watch the debates and learn about the candidates most of all look at the direction of the country and realize that where we are headed is not what i believe our founding fathers had in mind better yet has todays politician forgot that we have a consitution to follow. the teaparty has awaken alot of Amerians who don't want our great republic to fall to the socialist-marxist regine. i pray for november and our great republic.
|
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 1268 |
|
|
|
DaffyTaffy2
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/18/2010 : 4:20:29 PM
|
Thank you Sailaway! I would just like one polotician to stand up and say "My fellow Americans" as you know we r pulling our troops out from all over the world in the countries that do not support us and there would be a list of those countries published and all foreighn saide would stop immediatley! The ones who supported us we thank you and will not forget. The rest if you have a problem call France or China! LOL :) Or troops will be home guarding our boarders since we will have a ferw extra gazillian military vehicles avialablt for boarder patrol n controlling the drug trade!
Yes Nov. is not that far away!
Skinny Women are not Evil
|
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 205 |
|
|
|
Warmskin
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/22/2010 : 01:43:21 AM
|
quote:
Originally posted by NaturistDoc
Warmskin, I like your Madison quote. Here's an echo of sorts from Sinclair Lewis, circa 1935. "When Fascism comes to America, it will come wrapped in the flag, and carrying the cross."
One wonders what Madison and Lewis would have thought of Bush and the Neocons.
Hi Doc,
Yep, Madison adamently opposed wars proclaimed by kings, tyrants, and the like. That is why he put into the Constitution that the President would not have any power to make war; that was up to the people, through Congress.
The only wish I could ever make is that our Founders would come back, and rule us, just so we can see once again what America was supposed to be all about.
The neocons were originally Democrats who crossed over to the GOP around 1972, and have been a hemerroid to that party ever since. The GOP needs Preparation N for neocons. The GOP faithfuls seem to have developed the ability to overlook this 2 ton elephant in their living room. They are powerless to say anything about it, save for a few of them, such as Ron Paul, US Rep. Walter Jones, of one of the Carolinas, Pat Buchanan, Barry Goldwater Jr., Tucker Carlson, and Morning Joe (Scarborough). The rest are addicted to the neocons, and can't get enough of them.
Ironically, the neocons were initially followers of Leon Trotsky. If you can believe, the GOP mainstream is following, to a goodly extent, Leon Trotsky. It sounds upside down, but it's true. Facts are stranger than fiction.
Imagine if we had never interfered in the Mideast, we would have never had nine-11, or wasted over a trillion $$ overseas in wars. Divide 300 million into one trillion, and that is how much each American would have back in his pocket today. Hmm, that is 0.3 billion divided into 1000 billion $$, or about $3,333 for every living American. If we assume that each family has four people in it, then that would be $13,333.
What if each family received a check for $13,333 right now, because the government did not spend that money. Can we say -- better economy? I think so. Wars are quite harmful to economies, as we found out in 1920, after WW I, and in the late 1940s, after WW II. LBJ's "butter and guns" sent us into a deep recession in the mid-1970s. When will we learn? Answer -- only when the electorate learns.
As Adolf Hitler said -- it is well that the people don't think, it makes it easier for government to rule them -- or words to that effect.
"If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy."
James Madison
|
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 1964 |
|
|
|
balataf
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/23/2010 : 02:57:33 AM
|
Warmskin, your operative is if, and if, and if. It is better to deal with the problems around us than to dream of an ideal world with an idyllic neverland. The Islamic Terrorist ideology we face requires that we all follow their visions of Sharia Law. No nudism, for instance, only burkas folr all womenoutside the home. What we are left with is a "forward defene" strategy, a I learned when I got my degrees in European history and in foreign policy. The same strategy as when the US fought undeclared wars under both Jefferson and Madison until the Marines captured Tripoli. The basic principlesd are identical. Here is evidence that the Jeffersonians also had to deal with problems in the real world surrounding them. The personnel involved also included both Adamses and Monroe. Your perfect model never existed. "Too good to be true."
As to the Neocons, their movement is, indeed a strange journey from the Progressive Era in the Socialist Party, thru the New Deal, and crossing
over to Republican very, very gradually from 1968 into the Reagan coalition. It is worth noting that, while they had leaders like Moynihan and Condi Rice, the vast central core of them were Jewish New Yorkers in the academic andd publishing worlds a generation ago. Their basic viewpoint was that the McGovernized Democratic Party had lost its moorings and abandoned its roots in both foreign and domestic fields.
I spent 23 years as a Democratic Party official before becoming a Republican, feeling myself very abandoned. I took some great abusiveness before I switched, but delayed doing so, partly because of my Wife and myself being victims personally of one of the 1972 Watergate dirty tricks.
|
Edited by - balataf on 07/23/2010 03:17:06 AM |
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 661 |
|
|
|
OLD BUZZARD
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/25/2010 : 9:33:55 PM
|
I say that we should vote all incumbents out out of office. most of them have been there to long and have forgotten why they were elected. They dont care about the people just as long as they get re-elected. Its time to clean house come November.Lets all get out and VOTE and fix the problem,and take our country back.
not as good as I once was.......DAMMIT OLD BUZZARD
|
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 192 |
|
|
|
capecodjack
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/25/2010 : 10:29:05 PM
|
I am a new deal Democrat,
I was born in 1929 and although the crash came after my birth in June it certainly affected my childhood. My father worked for the WPA (FDR's Works Progress Administration). I would accompany him evenings when he would service a clientele of tea drinkers door to door. I still remember "oolong" and "orange peckoe". On Sunday he had a paper route.
As to today's problems, I know that Congress is subservient to the corporate lobbyists
and that the problem is momentous. It really needs a radical approach. I have told my five children that if some person (President,Senator,whatever) would tell me that if I donated $100 they would guarantee that no one is our great land would go to bed hungry I would gladly donate.
Health care. Simple solution. Take all the money that Big Pharma spends on advertising and seducing MDs and spend it on universal health care.
Come back tomorrow and I'll solve more problems.
The happy octogenarian.
Ask me about my bucket list
|
|
Country:
| Posts: 110 |
|
|
|
balataf
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/26/2010 : 12:03:27 AM
|
What Big Pharma spends on lobbyists and advertising? Nice dream, now how will you cover the other 99.1 cents of each dollar? Even the total cost of all drugs is only, maybe 7 per cent.
One of the biggest contributors to health care costs is better medicine, in this form: Pull a guy thru from serious problems such as cancer, heart attack, stroke, etc. For, say, $50,000 you have just bought the obligation to do it again in a few years with his next heart attack, stroke, or cancer round. It used to be alot cheaper when you only had to pay for a funeral at the first or second round, instead of keeping on.
Yo, NaturistDoc, and any other medical professionals Whadda ya say?
|
Edited by - balataf on 07/26/2010 2:13:38 PM |
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 661 |
|
|
|
jbsnc
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/27/2010 : 2:55:41 PM
|
capecodjack wrote:
“I was born in 1929 and although the crash came after my birth in June it certainly affected my childhood.”
Many were severely hit. Several economists, recently including two from UCLA, claim that FDR’s policies prolonged the depression by 8 years or so. FDR’s Secretary of Treasury Henry Morgenthau asserted that FDR’s policies were continuations of those initiated by Hoover. According to some economists, in 1920 Warren Harding faced financial situations as bad as did FDR in 1933. Harding cut taxes and cut spending and the situation was remedied in less than two years. Seems the most you hear about him is the Teapot Dome scandal.
“I would accompany him evenings when he would service a clientele of tea drinkers door to door. I still remember "oolong" and "orange peckoe.”
Remember ‘so long oolong how long you gonna be gone?’
“As to today's problems, I know that Congress is subservient to the corporate lobbyists and that the problem is momentous.”
If Congress were subservient to the broad based federal lobbyists (about 43,000) Pelosi-Reid-Obamacare would not have passed. Big money lobbyists such as Big Pharma must play ball with Congress in an attempt to protect their interests.
“I have told my five children that if some person (President,Senator,whatever) would tell me that if I donated $100 they would guarantee that no one is our great land would go to bed hungry I would gladly donate.”
Such a promise could never be fulfilled. Even to approach fulfillment would require mass enslavement and the death of freedom.
“Health care. Simple solution. Take all the money that Big Pharma spends on advertising and seducing MDs and spend it on universal health care.”
Universal health care in Canada and England compared to non-universal health care in America: Survival rate 5 years after detection of cancer, C=42% E=46% A=67%; beginning of treatment within n number of days, C=43% E=15% A=93%; Hip replacements done within n number of days, C=43% E=15% A=90%; number of MRI facilities per n number of population, C=18 E=14 A=71.
“Come back tomorrow and I'll solve more problems.”
Please do, this weekend I received a thick letter from the IRS stating that in 2008 I failed to report over $25,000 in income and owe them about $3,700. Help, help capecodjack!
Happy Nuding.
|
Edited by - jbsnc on 07/27/2010 2:57:32 PM |
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 153 |
|
|
|
Warmskin
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/29/2010 : 06:19:42 AM
|
I looked at Doc's poll link, and found there were no Libertarians. Uh-oh, I foresee a letter to the Gallup folks in the future. Hehehe.
I think the Tea Party has moved away from its original concept and is now being taken over by the Neoconservatives. The latter might have not like the original Tea Party because of its non-mainstream stands.
The Tea Party has had a fair amount of success, and when that happens, the powers that be have a mentally ill need to re-direct these movements to their own advantage. After all, they can't abide people doing things on their own, such as thinking independently. Egads!!
"If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy."
James Madison
|
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 1964 |
|
|
|
Warmskin
Forum Member
|
Posted - 07/29/2010 : 06:57:48 AM
|
Balataf said, "Warmskin, your operative is if, and if, and if."
Hi my friend! We, or course do need to deal with what is on our plate at present. We also need to learn from our mistakes over the last several decades, and our government has made some beauties in that department.
By learning, and perhaps only by learning, can we extricate ourselves from this trap we have made for ourselves.
Starting from the era of Woodrow Wilson's push to make the world safe for democracy (which the USA does not have, itself), we have butted into a lot of foreign situations. Some of these have cost us dearly. In WWI, we lost 100,000 soldiers for no reason. The result was an upset of our govt's budget. That in turn helped drain our nation's wealth, to the point that we had the worst depression of the last century, around 1920-1921.
Wilson did usher in a new concept that America was the world's fix-it nation. That was not part of the Founders' vision of steering clear of foreign entanglements. Since his days in office, America has meddled in foreign nations' internal affairs, save for Harding's "normalcy" and Coolidge's "the business of America is business."
Since we departed dramatically from our Founders' vision of who we should be, we have no doubt earned a lot of resentment overseas. Our late aggresiveness, designed by the neoconservatives in the 1990s, has ruined our reputation among many nations that used to have a high opinion of us.
Had we stuck steadfastly to the warnings of washington and Jefferson, there would have been a lot less difficulties overseas and at home for us. This is what we need to learn. Making the same mistakes over and over again will get us nowhere, except poorer and poorer. I find it odd that we have to make long-term errors overseas, and then have to pay over a trillion dollars to fix the bad results from our FDR-ish left-wing foreign initiatives that are Wilson's inventions. Can we grow and re-learn what worked fairly well before Wilson came on the scene?
That is why I think it is important to be hypothetical, for our progress comes from that. Failure, as we have today, should be a cause for educating ourselves, not for digging ourselves into a deeper rut. We should learn not to trust the essentially foreign Neoconservatives, disguised as Americans.
All we have seen is more of the same ideas that caused our present difficulties. Is it not practical to change course overseas, and recapture what used to be our neutralism that we enjoyed at one time?
One might ask, why was not Canada attacked nine years ago? Why the USA? Present thinking not only cannot answer that question, it will not answer that question, leaving us prone for more troubles and tragedies. Canadians and Americans are much the same people, yet our countries have very different ideas about foreign policies when it comes to meddling. While I don't like Canada's concept of socialism at all, at least they have a sensible and safe foreign outlook.
We used to be friends with Muslim countries, but that changed with our new off-balance attitudes about the Mideast. I liked Eisenhower's attitude about that area, and he kept us quite safe by diplomacy. We did business with the oil-rich nations there, and that was about it. We really had no other healthy interest over there.
My "ifs" are generated out of frustration against our government's stupidity in going out of their way to cause bad feelings with other nations that did not exist decades before. Yes, Islam has very different traditions, but so do other religions. Some of my fellow Christians have much different outlooks from what I experience. The best thing to do is to overlook these things. No one wins an argument about religions, but one can win a lot of resentment. Because we have warred againt them for a lot of years for reasons that were never pro-American, would it not be reasonable to think they might resent us?
Given that we are on a course of failure, I am naturally inclined to look at useful alternatives, and that puts me squarely into the "if" department. I can do no other, in the same way a dog can only bark, and not go "meow." Hehehe.
I am enjoying this meaty discussion, Balataf!1
"If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy."
James Madison
|
Edited by - Warmskin on 07/29/2010 06:58:45 AM |
|
Country: USA
| Posts: 1964 |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Nudist-Resorts.Org Discussion Forum Bulletin Board Nudism Clothing Optional Resort Naturism Nude Beaches |
© 2002-2020 SUN |
|
|
|
Tea Party Ten Point Platform
